Here to stay - Revision history

Matt: Text replacement - "[[Imperial Senate" to "[[Senate"

2026-01-15T12:52:47Z

Text replacement - "[[Imperial Senate" to "[[Senate"

← Older revision		Revision as of 12:52, 15 January 2026
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	Eilian looks at events in [[the Barrens]] and [[Ossium]], considering things that went well and things that went poorly. All of his proposals are predicated on the understanding that the orcs of Mareave - ''all'' the orcs of Mareave - are [[Imperial_Law_Overview#Individuals_and_the_law\|foreigners]]. The Empire has already [[386YE_Spring_Equinox_Senate_sessions#Ratify_Treaty_with_Beoraidh\|ratified a treaty]] with former Salt Lord Ehsan of [[Mareave#Beoraidh\|Beoraidh]] in which the people of the city and of [[Mareave#Sinfoyard\|Sinfoyard]] are granted that status. In theory, all the other orcs of Mareave are still barbarians. They have no protection under Imperial law, it is illegal to trade with or offer succour to them, and they can be killed with impunity. This disparity helps drive the resentment in the south and it is surprising that the ''entire'' territory is not uncooperative.		Eilian looks at events in [[the Barrens]] and [[Ossium]], considering things that went well and things that went poorly. All of his proposals are predicated on the understanding that the orcs of Mareave - ''all'' the orcs of Mareave - are [[Imperial_Law_Overview#Individuals_and_the_law\|foreigners]]. The Empire has already [[386YE_Spring_Equinox_Senate_sessions#Ratify_Treaty_with_Beoraidh\|ratified a treaty]] with former Salt Lord Ehsan of [[Mareave#Beoraidh\|Beoraidh]] in which the people of the city and of [[Mareave#Sinfoyard\|Sinfoyard]] are granted that status. In theory, all the other orcs of Mareave are still barbarians. They have no protection under Imperial law, it is illegal to trade with or offer succour to them, and they can be killed with impunity. This disparity helps drive the resentment in the south and it is surprising that the ''entire'' territory is not uncooperative.

	After consultation with the Civil Service, they have agreed to present an [[Senate_motion#Administrative_Motions\|administrative motion]] on Friday evening during the Autumn Equinox, asking the [[~~Imperial~~ Senate]] if the people of Mareave should be considered foreigners. The majority of the folk there are not fighting the Empire, and any who take up arms to do so would be treated as criminals under Imperial law. In his petition, he points out that while the Empire finds it easy to [[Powers_of_the_Imperial_Senate#Declaration_of_War\|declare war]] against its enemies, its ability to ''stop'' being at war is barely developed. Historically, this was because until a handful of decades ago the idea that conquered people - conquered ''orcs'' - might be able to live peacefully alongside Imperial citizens was inconceivable. Even as little as sixty years ago, the Empire would simply have killed, enslaved, or driven out everyone in Mareave as part-and-parcel of conquering the territory. Today, thanks to advances such as the [[The_Doctrines_of_the_Faith#The_Doctrine_of_Enlightenment\|Doctrine of Enlightenment]] and the efforts of people in all walks of like, that approach is widely seen as unacceptable.		After consultation with the Civil Service, they have agreed to present an [[Senate_motion#Administrative_Motions\|administrative motion]] on Friday evening during the Autumn Equinox, asking the [[Senate]] if the people of Mareave should be considered foreigners. The majority of the folk there are not fighting the Empire, and any who take up arms to do so would be treated as criminals under Imperial law. In his petition, he points out that while the Empire finds it easy to [[Powers_of_the_Imperial_Senate#Declaration_of_War\|declare war]] against its enemies, its ability to ''stop'' being at war is barely developed. Historically, this was because until a handful of decades ago the idea that conquered people - conquered ''orcs'' - might be able to live peacefully alongside Imperial citizens was inconceivable. Even as little as sixty years ago, the Empire would simply have killed, enslaved, or driven out everyone in Mareave as part-and-parcel of conquering the territory. Today, thanks to advances such as the [[The_Doctrines_of_the_Faith#The_Doctrine_of_Enlightenment\|Doctrine of Enlightenment]] and the efforts of people in all walks of like, that approach is widely seen as unacceptable.

	Solving the problem of peace is not part of Eilian's remit (his casual suggestion is that [[Powers_of_the_Imperial_Senate#Assignment\|assignment]] explicitly declare peace with anyone in the territory, and let the law sort out people who keep fighting, causes several members of the Constitutional Court to sputter into their morning tea). If the Imperial Senate does not wish to pass the proposed administrative motion, they would still be able to declare individual orcs in Mareave to be foreigners, of course, with individual motions, but one of the challenges is that the three main groups are not part of the same faction. It would take up to three motions to declare them foreigners individually (or even more if the Empire wanted to stop treating any people of the northern regions who have not bonded to an Imperial egregore as barbarians).		Solving the problem of peace is not part of Eilian's remit (his casual suggestion is that [[Powers_of_the_Imperial_Senate#Assignment\|assignment]] explicitly declare peace with anyone in the territory, and let the law sort out people who keep fighting, causes several members of the Constitutional Court to sputter into their morning tea). If the Imperial Senate does not wish to pass the proposed administrative motion, they would still be able to declare individual orcs in Mareave to be foreigners, of course, with individual motions, but one of the challenges is that the three main groups are not part of the same faction. It would take up to three motions to declare them foreigners individually (or even more if the Empire wanted to stop treating any people of the northern regions who have not bonded to an Imperial egregore as barbarians).

Twiggy at 21:22, 30 July 2025

2025-07-30T21:22:10Z

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	* [[We all stand]] - 386YE Autumn wind of fortune detailing various contributions to the prosperity of Mareave		* [[We all stand]] - 386YE Autumn wind of fortune detailing various contributions to the prosperity of Mareave
	* [[Digging for fire]] - 386YE Summer wind of fortune detailing the Golden Pyramid contribution in Mareave		* [[Digging for fire]] - 386YE Summer wind of fortune detailing the Golden Pyramid contribution in Mareave
	* [[Into the spin]] – 386YE Spring wind of fortune ~~summarizing~~ the situation in Mareave		* [[Into the spin]] – 386YE Spring wind of fortune summarising the situation in Mareave

Twiggy at 22:16, 15 July 2025

2025-07-15T22:16:21Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 22:16, 15 July 2025
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	<tr><td>'''Location:''' Ohwinn Dell, Clisearn</td></tr>		<tr><td>'''Location:''' Ohwinn Dell, Clisearn</td></tr>
	<tr><td>'''Cost:''' 50 wains of mithril, 30 Crowns, three months</td></tr>		<tr><td>'''Cost:''' 50 wains of mithril, 30 Crowns, three months</td></tr>
	<tr><td>'''Special:''' Base labour costs would normally be 150 crowns, but ~~are~~ are reduced to 0 by the inspiration of Thrace; the remaining 30 crowns are due to the [[Set_my_lands_in_order#Under-developed\|Under Developed]] quality and are not reduced by that opportunity</td></tr>		<tr><td>'''Special:''' Base labour costs would normally be 150 crowns, but are reduced to 0 by the inspiration of Thrace; the remaining 30 crowns are due to the [[Set_my_lands_in_order#Under-developed\|Under Developed]] quality and are not reduced by that opportunity</td></tr>
	<tr><td>'''Effect:''' Increases the level of investment for mines in the territory by one, providing 2 ingots or 36 rings to every mine in Mareave</td></tr>		<tr><td>'''Effect:''' Increases the level of investment for mines in the territory by one, providing 2 ingots or 36 rings to every mine in Mareave</td></tr>
	<tr><td>'''Effect:''' Removes the uncooperative quality from Clisearn if the orcs are also made foreigners</td></tr>		<tr><td>'''Effect:''' Removes the uncooperative quality from Clisearn if the orcs are also made foreigners</td></tr>

Matt: /* Hollow Prestige */

2025-04-22T00:46:54Z

Hollow Prestige

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	The ''Clisearn Grand Market'' would serve as a place to buy and sell goods, and as a gathering place for workers, engineers, and miners. It would attract those looking for good wages across both Mareave and the wider Empire. Built near the Fundindelve, it would focus on mining, but farm labourers and other workers could be recruited here as well. It would also present a convenient way for Clisearn landowners to find employees to work their mines and their farms.		The ''Clisearn Grand Market'' would serve as a place to buy and sell goods, and as a gathering place for workers, engineers, and miners. It would attract those looking for good wages across both Mareave and the wider Empire. Built near the Fundindelve, it would focus on mining, but farm labourers and other workers could be recruited here as well. It would also present a convenient way for Clisearn landowners to find employees to work their mines and their farms.

	The hills and mountains of Mareave are very rich in metal; recognising that Eilian proposes that an Imperial Orc be appointed to oversee the Grand Market. The ''Steward of Works'' would be an Imperial Orcs national position appointed each year by [[Tally of the Votes]]. They would be responsible for looking after the Grand Market, but they would also be responsible for liaising with the families of Clisearn. As part of their role, they would be able to encourage the mines of Mareave to focus their efforts on metals useful to [[Crafting skills#Artisan\|artisans]], or precious metals such as gold, silver, or iron. ('''OOC Note:''' During downtime after an event, the Steward could email [plot@profounddecisions.co.uk plot] and shift the benefit provided to mines by the great work to be either 2 ingots of their base type, or 36 rings representing investment in precious metals. The benefit would remain set to one or the other until the Steward chose to change them again).		The hills and mountains of Mareave are very rich in metal; recognising that Eilian proposes that an Imperial Orc be appointed to oversee the Grand Market. The ''Steward of Works'' would be an Imperial Orcs national position appointed each year by [[Tally of the Votes]]. They would be responsible for looking after the Grand Market, but they would also be responsible for liaising with the families of Clisearn. As part of their role, they would be able to encourage the mines of Mareave to focus their efforts on metals useful to [[Crafting skills#Artisan\|artisans]], or precious metals such as gold, silver, or iron. ('''OOC Note:''' During downtime after an event, the Steward could email [mailto:plot@profounddecisions.co.uk plot] and shift the benefit provided to mines by the great work to be either 2 ingots of their base type, or 36 rings representing investment in precious metals. The benefit would remain set to one or the other until the Steward chose to change them again).

	While the work to bring prosperity to the territory would be valuable, the real benefit of the Great Work and related title would be the effect it would have on the Clisearn families. Having an "Imperial official" specifically to address their concerns would help restore their lost sense of prestige and importance, giving them the impression they are at least as significant as the court of former Salt Lord Ehsan. A great work helps everyone in a territory, so the Clisearn families would be able to find workers for their own mines and farms, but crucially they would find it easier to employ such workers if they were Imperial citizens - their own self-interest may start to incline them towards considering joining the Empire.		While the work to bring prosperity to the territory would be valuable, the real benefit of the Great Work and related title would be the effect it would have on the Clisearn families. Having an "Imperial official" specifically to address their concerns would help restore their lost sense of prestige and importance, giving them the impression they are at least as significant as the court of former Salt Lord Ehsan. A great work helps everyone in a territory, so the Clisearn families would be able to find workers for their own mines and farms, but crucially they would find it easier to employ such workers if they were Imperial citizens - their own self-interest may start to incline them towards considering joining the Empire.

Hailmur: /* Not Going Anywhere */

2025-04-19T01:29:54Z

Not Going Anywhere

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	<tr><td>'''Commission Type:'''Fortification</td></tr>		<tr><td>'''Commission Type:'''Fortification</td></tr>
	<tr><td>'''Location:''' Skouran Ruins, Eoradal</td></tr>		<tr><td>'''Location:''' Skouran Ruins, Eoradal</td></tr>
	<tr><td>'''Cost:''' 80 wains of white granite, 100 ~~Crowns~~, one year</td></tr>		<tr><td>'''Cost:''' 80 wains of white granite, 100 crowns, one year</td></tr>
	<tr><td>'''Upkeep:''' 10 ~~Thrones~~</td></tr>		<tr><td>'''Upkeep:''' 10 thrones</td></tr>
	<tr><td>'''Special:''' Base labour costs would be 240 crowns, but are reduced to 0 by the Thrace opportunity. The remaining costs - 48 crowns due to the [[Set_my_lands_in_order#Under-developed\|Under Developed]] quality, and 60 crowns to employ Eoradal orc assistance, are not reduced by that opportunity</td></tr>		<tr><td>'''Special:''' Base labour costs would be 240 crowns, but are reduced to 0 by the Thrace opportunity. The remaining costs - 48 crowns due to the [[Set_my_lands_in_order#Under-developed\|Under Developed]] quality, and 60 crowns to employ Eoradal orc assistance, are not reduced by that opportunity</td></tr>
	<tr><td>'''Special:''' The support of a Summer eternal to infuse it with adamant is required</td></tr></td></tr>		<tr><td>'''Special:''' The support of a Summer eternal to infuse it with adamant is required</td></tr></td></tr>
	<tr><td>'''Effect:''' Removes uncooperative quality from ~~Clisearn~~, establishes walled settlement in Mareave</td></tr>		<tr><td>'''Effect:''' Removes uncooperative quality from Eoradal, establishes walled settlement in Mareave</td></tr>
	</table></div>		</table></div>
	* '''Outside of Beoraidh and Fioroult there are few large settlements in Mareave'''		* '''Outside of Beoraidh and Fioroult there are few large settlements in Mareave'''
	* '''Eilian and the Tamazi propose the Imperial Orcs establish a fortified town in Eoradal'''		* '''Eilian and the Tamazi propose the Imperial Orcs establish a fortified town in Eoradal'''
	The challenge here is to convince Eoradal, and the outspoken Uthni, that not only are the Imperial Orcs here to stay, but that they will ''come back'' in the event their dominion is challenged. Showing the people here that they genuinely view Mareave as part of their Empire, and as part of the Imperial Orcs nation, will challenge their cynicism and encourage them to make ~~accommodation~~ with the Imperial Orcs. While the orcs may be cynical about the border, they know that the Empire has endured for nearly four centuries. It represents permanence once it sets its mind to things.		The challenge here is to convince Eoradal, and the outspoken Uthni, that not only are the Imperial Orcs here to stay, but that they will ''come back'' in the event their dominion is challenged. Showing the people here that they genuinely view Mareave as part of their Empire, and as part of the Imperial Orcs nation, will challenge their cynicism and encourage them to make accommodations with the Imperial Orcs. While the orcs may be cynical about the border, they know that the Empire has endured for nearly four centuries. It represents permanence once it sets its mind to things.

	So with Ketus' assistance, Eilian presents plans for a fortified town - or more realistically a fortified and walled settlement that will grow into a town (or even a city) one day. The settlement would represent a kind of territorial capital for their people, and as it is roughly in the middle of the territory, Eoradal represents the ideal place to establish it. There are also ruins in the east of the territory that once marked a large [[Skoura\|Skouran]] settlement, that was supported by a long-since collapsed aqueduct bringing fresh water down from the mountains. The labour costs are higher than might be expected, even allowing for the problems of moving materials to Mareave. This is because part of Eilian's plan involves offering incentives to the Eoradal orcs to help the Imperial Orcs dig wells, clear the site, and raise walls, demonstrating that it is more rewarding to work with the Empire than against it.		So with Ketus' assistance, Eilian presents plans for a fortified town - or more realistically a fortified and walled settlement that will grow into a town (or even a city) one day. The settlement would represent a kind of territorial capital for their people, and as it is roughly in the middle of the territory, Eoradal represents the ideal place to establish it. There are also ruins in the east of the territory that once marked a large [[Skoura\|Skouran]] settlement, that was supported by a long-since collapsed aqueduct bringing fresh water down from the mountains. The labour costs are higher than might be expected, even allowing for the problems of moving materials to Mareave. This is because part of Eilian's plan involves offering incentives to the Eoradal orcs to help the Imperial Orcs dig wells, clear the site, and raise walls, demonstrating that it is more rewarding to work with the Empire than against it.

Wrenna at 21:11, 29 March 2025

2025-03-29T21:11:31Z

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	The challenge here is to convince Eoradal, and the outspoken Uthni, that not only are the Imperial Orcs here to stay, but that they will ''come back'' in the event their dominion is challenged. Showing the people here that they genuinely view Mareave as part of their Empire, and as part of the Imperial Orcs nation, will challenge their cynicism and encourage them to make accommodation with the Imperial Orcs. While the orcs may be cynical about the border, they know that the Empire has endured for nearly four centuries. It represents permanence once it sets its mind to things.		The challenge here is to convince Eoradal, and the outspoken Uthni, that not only are the Imperial Orcs here to stay, but that they will ''come back'' in the event their dominion is challenged. Showing the people here that they genuinely view Mareave as part of their Empire, and as part of the Imperial Orcs nation, will challenge their cynicism and encourage them to make accommodation with the Imperial Orcs. While the orcs may be cynical about the border, they know that the Empire has endured for nearly four centuries. It represents permanence once it sets its mind to things.

	So with Ketus' assistance, Eilian presents plans for a fortified town - or more realistically a fortified and walled settlement that will grow into a town (or ~~event~~ a city) one day. The settlement would represent a kind of territorial capital for their people, and as it is roughly in the middle of the territory, Eoradal represents the ideal place to establish it. There are also ruins in the east of the territory that once marked a large [[Skoura\|Skouran]] settlement, that was supported by a long-since collapsed aqueduct bringing fresh water down from the mountains. The labour costs are higher than might be expected, even allowing for the problems of moving materials to Mareave. This is because part of Eilian's plan involves offering incentives to the Eoradal orcs to help the Imperial Orcs dig wells, clear the site, and raise walls, demonstrating that it is more rewarding to work with the Empire than against it.		So with Ketus' assistance, Eilian presents plans for a fortified town - or more realistically a fortified and walled settlement that will grow into a town (or even a city) one day. The settlement would represent a kind of territorial capital for their people, and as it is roughly in the middle of the territory, Eoradal represents the ideal place to establish it. There are also ruins in the east of the territory that once marked a large [[Skoura\|Skouran]] settlement, that was supported by a long-since collapsed aqueduct bringing fresh water down from the mountains. The labour costs are higher than might be expected, even allowing for the problems of moving materials to Mareave. This is because part of Eilian's plan involves offering incentives to the Eoradal orcs to help the Imperial Orcs dig wells, clear the site, and raise walls, demonstrating that it is more rewarding to work with the Empire than against it.

	The centrepiece of the settlement would be a bastion or fortress, and every settlement needs protective walls. In time Ketus suggests that the settlement could grow to rival Beoraidh or Gildenheim. Coincidentally, this is exactly the kind of urban centre the Tamazi favour. Quite a few of the Tamazi are enthusiastic about establishing a settlement in Mareave – previously from Axos the climate here is much closer to what they many of them are familiar with. If the Imperial Orcs commit to creating a settlement here, then substantial numbers of the sept would move south to help build it. By metaphorically driving a pin into the map saying “Mareave is an Imperial Orcs territory and we plan to keep it that way", and by showing the Eoradal orcs that they can profit from working with the Empire, they can win the recalcitrant orcs round and silence cynical voices.		The centrepiece of the settlement would be a bastion or fortress, and every settlement needs protective walls. In time Ketus suggests that the settlement could grow to rival Beoraidh or Gildenheim. Coincidentally, this is exactly the kind of urban centre the Tamazi favour. Quite a few of the Tamazi are enthusiastic about establishing a settlement in Mareave – previously from Axos the climate here is much closer to what they many of them are familiar with. If the Imperial Orcs commit to creating a settlement here, then substantial numbers of the sept would move south to help build it. By metaphorically driving a pin into the map saying “Mareave is an Imperial Orcs territory and we plan to keep it that way", and by showing the Eoradal orcs that they can profit from working with the Empire, they can win the recalcitrant orcs round and silence cynical voices.

Rafferty: /* Resolution */

2024-09-25T10:37:07Z

Resolution

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	The Prognosticator's Office is not the only force busily exploring the Empire's newest territory this season. The Imperial Orcs assembly asked representatives of the [[Tamazi]] to look for opportunities here; the [[Grandmaster]] of the [[Golden Pyramid]] directed their [[Conclave order]] to seek ways to improve the territory's prosperity; and the [[the Marches\|Marcher]], [[the Brass Coast\|Freeborn]], and [[the League\|League]] assemblies all urged their nation to offer their expertise to help the Imperial Orcs in Mareave. Details of what they have been up to are recounted in the '''[[We all stand]]''' wind of fortune.		The Prognosticator's Office is not the only force busily exploring the Empire's newest territory this season. The Imperial Orcs assembly asked representatives of the [[Tamazi]] to look for opportunities here; the [[Grandmaster]] of the [[Golden Pyramid]] directed their [[Conclave order]] to seek ways to improve the territory's prosperity; and the [[the Marches\|Marcher]], [[the Brass Coast\|Freeborn]], and [[the League\|League]] assemblies all urged their nation to offer their expertise to help the Imperial Orcs in Mareave. Details of what they have been up to are recounted in the '''[[We all stand]]''' wind of fortune.
	==Resolution==		==Resolution==
	The Imperial Senate voted to [[386YE_Autumn_Equinox_Senate_sessions#Peace_in_Mareave\|recognise all the orcs in Mareave]] not actively fighting the Empire as foreigners. They also [[386YE_Autumn_Equinox_Senate_sessions#Criminalise_hunting_turtles_in_Bay_of_Catazar\|criminalised the hunting of turtles]] in the Bay of Catazar.		The Imperial Senate voted to [[386YE_Autumn_Equinox_Senate_sessions#Peace_in_Mareave\|recognise all the orcs in Mareave]] not actively fighting the Empire as foreigners. They also [[386YE_Autumn_Equinox_Senate_sessions#Criminalise_hunting_turtles_in_Bay_of_Catazar\|criminalised the hunting of turtles]] in the Bay of Catazar.

			At the [[386YE_Autumn_Equinox_Synod_judgements#Judgement_211\|request of '''Bloodcrow Pip''']] the Imperial Orcs national assembly sent '''Skywise Tylva''' to urge the Illarawm to approach the Brine Turtles peacefully and open negotiations with them.

	==Further Reading==		==Further Reading==
	* [[Mareave]]		* [[Mareave]]

Rafferty at 10:12, 25 September 2024

2024-09-25T10:12:35Z

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	* '''There are a series of other opportunities relating to Mareave this season'''		* '''There are a series of other opportunities relating to Mareave this season'''
	The Prognosticator's Office is not the only force busily exploring the Empire's newest territory this season. The Imperial Orcs assembly asked representatives of the [[Tamazi]] to look for opportunities here; the [[Grandmaster]] of the [[Golden Pyramid]] directed their [[Conclave order]] to seek ways to improve the territory's prosperity; and the [[the Marches\|Marcher]], [[the Brass Coast\|Freeborn]], and [[the League\|League]] assemblies all urged their nation to offer their expertise to help the Imperial Orcs in Mareave. Details of what they have been up to are recounted in the '''[[We all stand]]''' wind of fortune.		The Prognosticator's Office is not the only force busily exploring the Empire's newest territory this season. The Imperial Orcs assembly asked representatives of the [[Tamazi]] to look for opportunities here; the [[Grandmaster]] of the [[Golden Pyramid]] directed their [[Conclave order]] to seek ways to improve the territory's prosperity; and the [[the Marches\|Marcher]], [[the Brass Coast\|Freeborn]], and [[the League\|League]] assemblies all urged their nation to offer their expertise to help the Imperial Orcs in Mareave. Details of what they have been up to are recounted in the '''[[We all stand]]''' wind of fortune.
			==Resolution==
			The Imperial Senate voted to [[386YE_Autumn_Equinox_Senate_sessions#Peace_in_Mareave\|recognise all the orcs in Mareave]] not actively fighting the Empire as foreigners. They also [[386YE_Autumn_Equinox_Senate_sessions#Criminalise_hunting_turtles_in_Bay_of_Catazar\|criminalised the hunting of turtles]] in the Bay of Catazar.
	==Further Reading==		==Further Reading==
	* [[Mareave]]		* [[Mareave]]

Novemberalice at 12:41, 11 September 2024

2024-09-11T12:41:02Z

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	"Certainly mock if you like. But, even so, it really is a great way to say ''we are here to stay'', and it's an even better way to say ''if we leave we are definitely coming back, because all our things are here''."</ic>		"Certainly mock if you like. But, even so, it really is a great way to say ''we are here to stay'', and it's an even better way to say ''if we leave we are definitely coming back, because all our things are here''."</ic>
	<div style="float:left; width: 500px; clear: right;">{{CaptionedImage\|file=Grumpy Turtle.jpg\|align=left\|caption=The folk of southern [[Mareave]] refuse to cooperate with the Empire, or the Empire.\|width=500}}</div>		<div style="float:left; width: 500px; clear: right;">{{CaptionedImage\|file=Grumpy Turtle.jpg\|align=left\|caption=The folk of southern [[Mareave]] refuse to cooperate with the Empire, or the Empire.\|width=500}}</div>{{audio\|link=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dfwa6ypFY_U}}
	{{PDFLink\|align=right\|link=File:Here_to_stay.pdf\|caption=Click for pdf version}}		{{PDFLink\|align=right\|link=File:Here_to_stay.pdf\|caption=Click for pdf version}}
	==Overview==		==Overview==

Hailmur at 09:42, 10 September 2024

2024-09-10T09:42:16Z

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	"Certainly mock if you like. But, even so, it really is a great way to say ''we are here to stay'', and it's an even better way to say ''if we leave we are definitely coming back, because all our things are here''."</ic>		"Certainly mock if you like. But, even so, it really is a great way to say ''we are here to stay'', and it's an even better way to say ''if we leave we are definitely coming back, because all our things are here''."</ic>
	<div style="float:left; width: 500px; clear: right;">{{CaptionedImage\|file=Grumpy Turtle.jpg\|align=left\|caption=The folk of southern [[Mareave]] refuse to cooperate with the Empire, or the Empire.\|width=500}}</div>		<div style="float:left; width: 500px; clear: right;">{{CaptionedImage\|file=Grumpy Turtle.jpg\|align=left\|caption=The folk of southern [[Mareave]] refuse to cooperate with the Empire, or the Empire.\|width=500}}</div>
			{{PDFLink\|align=right\|link=File:Here_to_stay.pdf\|caption=Click for pdf version}}
	==Overview==		==Overview==
	During the Summer Solstice, the Imperial Senate commissioned [[Appraisal#Eilian_Sweetwater\|Eilian Sweetwater]] to undertake an [[appraisal]] in the newly conquered [[territory]] of [[Mareave]]. He was asked to find ways to deal with the [[Set_my_lands_in_order#Uncooperative\|uncooperative]] inhabitants of the southern regions - [[Mareave#Fleisardh\|Fleisardh]], [[Mareave#Clisearn\|Clisearn]] and [[Mareave#Eoradal\|Eoradal]].		During the Summer Solstice, the Imperial Senate commissioned [[Appraisal#Eilian_Sweetwater\|Eilian Sweetwater]] to undertake an [[appraisal]] in the newly conquered [[territory]] of [[Mareave]]. He was asked to find ways to deal with the [[Set_my_lands_in_order#Uncooperative\|uncooperative]] inhabitants of the southern regions - [[Mareave#Fleisardh\|Fleisardh]], [[Mareave#Clisearn\|Clisearn]] and [[Mareave#Eoradal\|Eoradal]].

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	Eilian looks at events in [[the Barrens]] and [[Ossium]], considering things that went well and things that went poorly. All of his proposals are predicated on the understanding that the orcs of Mareave - ''all'' the orcs of Mareave - are [[Imperial_Law_Overview#Individuals_and_the_law\|foreigners]]. The Empire has already [[386YE_Spring_Equinox_Senate_sessions#Ratify_Treaty_with_Beoraidh\|ratified a treaty]] with former Salt Lord Ehsan of [[Mareave#Beoraidh\|Beoraidh]] in which the people of the city and of [[Mareave#Sinfoyard\|Sinfoyard]] are granted that status. In theory, all the other orcs of Mareave are still barbarians. They have no protection under Imperial law, it is illegal to trade with or offer succour to them, and they can be killed with impunity. This disparity helps drive the resentment in the south and it is surprising that the ''entire'' territory is not uncooperative.		Eilian looks at events in [[the Barrens]] and [[Ossium]], considering things that went well and things that went poorly. All of his proposals are predicated on the understanding that the orcs of Mareave - ''all'' the orcs of Mareave - are [[Imperial_Law_Overview#Individuals_and_the_law\|foreigners]]. The Empire has already [[386YE_Spring_Equinox_Senate_sessions#Ratify_Treaty_with_Beoraidh\|ratified a treaty]] with former Salt Lord Ehsan of [[Mareave#Beoraidh\|Beoraidh]] in which the people of the city and of [[Mareave#Sinfoyard\|Sinfoyard]] are granted that status. In theory, all the other orcs of Mareave are still barbarians. They have no protection under Imperial law, it is illegal to trade with or offer succour to them, and they can be killed with impunity. This disparity helps drive the resentment in the south and it is surprising that the ''entire'' territory is not uncooperative.

	After consultation with the Civil Service, they have agreed to present an [[Senate_motion#Administrative_Motions\|administrative motion]] on Friday evening during the Autumn Equinox, asking the [[~~Imperial~~ Senate]] if the people of Mareave should be considered foreigners. The majority of the folk there are not fighting the Empire, and any who take up arms to do so would be treated as criminals under Imperial law. In his petition, he points out that while the Empire finds it easy to [[Powers_of_the_Imperial_Senate#Declaration_of_War\|declare war]] against its enemies, its ability to ''stop'' being at war is barely developed. Historically, this was because until a handful of decades ago the idea that conquered people - conquered ''orcs'' - might be able to live peacefully alongside Imperial citizens was inconceivable. Even as little as sixty years ago, the Empire would simply have killed, enslaved, or driven out everyone in Mareave as part-and-parcel of conquering the territory. Today, thanks to advances such as the [[The_Doctrines_of_the_Faith#The_Doctrine_of_Enlightenment\|Doctrine of Enlightenment]] and the efforts of people in all walks of like, that approach is widely seen as unacceptable.		After consultation with the Civil Service, they have agreed to present an [[Senate_motion#Administrative_Motions\|administrative motion]] on Friday evening during the Autumn Equinox, asking the [[Senate]] if the people of Mareave should be considered foreigners. The majority of the folk there are not fighting the Empire, and any who take up arms to do so would be treated as criminals under Imperial law. In his petition, he points out that while the Empire finds it easy to [[Powers_of_the_Imperial_Senate#Declaration_of_War\|declare war]] against its enemies, its ability to ''stop'' being at war is barely developed. Historically, this was because until a handful of decades ago the idea that conquered people - conquered ''orcs'' - might be able to live peacefully alongside Imperial citizens was inconceivable. Even as little as sixty years ago, the Empire would simply have killed, enslaved, or driven out everyone in Mareave as part-and-parcel of conquering the territory. Today, thanks to advances such as the [[The_Doctrines_of_the_Faith#The_Doctrine_of_Enlightenment\|Doctrine of Enlightenment]] and the efforts of people in all walks of like, that approach is widely seen as unacceptable.

	Solving the problem of peace is not part of Eilian's remit (his casual suggestion is that [[Powers_of_the_Imperial_Senate#Assignment\|assignment]] explicitly declare peace with anyone in the territory, and let the law sort out people who keep fighting, causes several members of the Constitutional Court to sputter into their morning tea). If the Imperial Senate does not wish to pass the proposed administrative motion, they would still be able to declare individual orcs in Mareave to be foreigners, of course, with individual motions, but one of the challenges is that the three main groups are not part of the same faction. It would take up to three motions to declare them foreigners individually (or even more if the Empire wanted to stop treating any people of the northern regions who have not bonded to an Imperial egregore as barbarians).		Solving the problem of peace is not part of Eilian's remit (his casual suggestion is that [[Powers_of_the_Imperial_Senate#Assignment\|assignment]] explicitly declare peace with anyone in the territory, and let the law sort out people who keep fighting, causes several members of the Constitutional Court to sputter into their morning tea). If the Imperial Senate does not wish to pass the proposed administrative motion, they would still be able to declare individual orcs in Mareave to be foreigners, of course, with individual motions, but one of the challenges is that the three main groups are not part of the same faction. It would take up to three motions to declare them foreigners individually (or even more if the Empire wanted to stop treating any people of the northern regions who have not bonded to an Imperial egregore as barbarians).