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Matt: Text replacement - "[[Imperial Military Council" to "[[Military Council"

2026-01-15T12:24:00Z

Text replacement - "[[Imperial Military Council" to "[[Military Council"

← Older revision		Revision as of 12:24, 15 January 2026
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	This is somewhat similar to the proposal Jereboam of Sanctuary made in Autumn last year that [[Tested_again_and_again#Virtuous_Diplomacy\|ambassadors should be appointed by the General assembly]] but it represents a significantly smaller transfer of power from the Senate, to a Senate appointed position. As such Prince Benjamin and his supporters do not believe it would constitute a [[Senate_motion#Constitutional_Vote\|Constitutional vote]].		This is somewhat similar to the proposal Jereboam of Sanctuary made in Autumn last year that [[Tested_again_and_again#Virtuous_Diplomacy\|ambassadors should be appointed by the General assembly]] but it represents a significantly smaller transfer of power from the Senate, to a Senate appointed position. As such Prince Benjamin and his supporters do not believe it would constitute a [[Senate_motion#Constitutional_Vote\|Constitutional vote]].

	Obviously, the [[Imperial Fleet Master]] would remain a [[~~Imperial~~ Military Council\|Military]] appointment and not something for the Consul to worry about - unless the Senate changed that separately - but Prince Benjamin doesn't really count the Fleet Master as a ''proper'' ambassador whatever the [[Grendel]] may say.		Obviously, the [[Imperial Fleet Master]] would remain a [[Military Council\|Military]] appointment and not something for the Consul to worry about - unless the Senate changed that separately - but Prince Benjamin doesn't really count the Fleet Master as a ''proper'' ambassador whatever the [[Grendel]] may say.

	If the Senate chose to pursue this path, they could combine the amendment to the Consul's powers with the same motion required to commission the Consulate.		If the Senate chose to pursue this path, they could combine the amendment to the Consul's powers with the same motion required to commission the Consulate.

Dre at 09:31, 21 March 2025

2025-03-21T09:31:33Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 09:31, 21 March 2025
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	==The Imperial Consulate==		==The Imperial Consulate==
	* '''A proposal has been made to construct an Imperial Consulate'''		* '''A proposal has been made to construct an Imperial Consulate'''
	During the Spring ~~Solstice~~ 383YE, the Senate voted to amend the powers of the [[Imperial Consul]] to make them a [[Senate_session#Member_of_the_Senate\|member of the Senate]]. It seems as if the position of Consul has been controversial since its inception in the Summer of 379YE, with questions asked about the remit of its authority and its purpose in the wider Empire. For now though, it seems that most people have accepted that the Consul both deals with diplomatic incidents that do not involve the foreign nations the Empire has appointed [[Ambassador\|ambassadors]] to deal with, and serves as a liaison between the diplomatic corps and the Senate.		During the Spring Equinox 383YE, the Senate voted to amend the powers of the [[Imperial Consul]] to make them a [[Senate_session#Member_of_the_Senate\|member of the Senate]]. It seems as if the position of Consul has been controversial since its inception in the Summer of 379YE, with questions asked about the remit of its authority and its purpose in the wider Empire. For now though, it seems that most people have accepted that the Consul both deals with diplomatic incidents that do not involve the foreign nations the Empire has appointed [[Ambassador\|ambassadors]] to deal with, and serves as a liaison between the diplomatic corps and the Senate.

	Yet it seems that the Consul has always struggled to do their job. The Great Forest Orcs and the orcs of the Mournwold alike have tended to ignore the Consul. The Grendel preferred the company of the Imperial Fleet Master. The Thule wanted to deal mostly with the Varushkans, even before they grudgingly agreed to embassies between Otkodov and the Empire. Even the Feni seemed largely disinterested in the Consul during the recent unpleasantness in Mournwold and Hahnmark.		Yet it seems that the Consul has always struggled to do their job. The Great Forest Orcs and the orcs of the Mournwold alike have tended to ignore the Consul. The Grendel preferred the company of the Imperial Fleet Master. The Thule wanted to deal mostly with the Varushkans, even before they grudgingly agreed to embassies between Otkodov and the Empire. Even the Feni seemed largely disinterested in the Consul during the recent unpleasantness in Mournwold and Hahnmark.

Dre at 21:51, 13 May 2024

2024-05-13T21:51:24Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 21:51, 13 May 2024
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	Her proposal is for a mutual association, formed by five of the mining guilds, and working in conjunction with the apothecaries of Seren to the enrichment of both cities. Seren has few mines, but it has an abundance of herbalists and healers of all types. Mining is dangerous work - and despite the efforts of the [[Master_of_the_Clearing_House#Tassato_Apothecary_Clearing_House\|Apothecary Clearing House]] there is still a significant need for healing herbs on both sides of the river.		Her proposal is for a mutual association, formed by five of the mining guilds, and working in conjunction with the apothecaries of Seren to the enrichment of both cities. Seren has few mines, but it has an abundance of herbalists and healers of all types. Mining is dangerous work - and despite the efforts of the [[Master_of_the_Clearing_House#Tassato_Apothecary_Clearing_House\|Apothecary Clearing House]] there is still a significant need for healing herbs on both sides of the river.

	Her plan involves building a trading post - an inn, warehouses, and residences - at the base of the hills in western Madeiras. The mining guilds - ~~lead~~ by the ''Forge and Furnace Fellowship'' of course - would divert ore directly from the mines to the trading post for sale to Navarr merchants prepared to travel the extra miles from Tagliano. Half the buildings would be given over to the Navarr, who would use them to sell herbs to the Tassatan mining guilds at a reasonable price.		Her plan involves building a trading post - an inn, warehouses, and residences - at the base of the hills in western Madeiras. The mining guilds - led by the ''Forge and Furnace Fellowship'' of course - would divert ore directly from the mines to the trading post for sale to Navarr merchants prepared to travel the extra miles from Tagliano. Half the buildings would be given over to the Navarr, who would use them to sell herbs to the Tassatan mining guilds at a reasonable price.

	Gemma's proposal would require 15 wains of mithril (to lay tracks to transport the ore) and 10 wains of weirwood. Labour would cost 50 crowns, and it would take three months to complete construction, It could be [[commission\|commissioned]] with a [[Senate motion]] or an [[Bearer of an Imperial Wayleave\|Imperial Wayleave]]. Once complete it would create not one but ''two'' [[Imperial title\|Imperial titles]]. One would be appointed by business owners of the League - perhaps called something like ''Representative of the Mestran Hills Association'' - while the other would be appointed by the [[herb garden]] owners of Navarr - perhaps ''Representative of the Miaren Herbalist Fellowships''. Both would be annual Bourse titles, and each would control a [[ministry]]. If any decisions needed to be made about the Madieras Mutual Association, they would need to make them together - unanimous decisions of both the League and Navarr title holders.		Gemma's proposal would require 15 wains of mithril (to lay tracks to transport the ore) and 10 wains of weirwood. Labour would cost 50 crowns, and it would take three months to complete construction, It could be [[commission\|commissioned]] with a [[Senate motion]] or an [[Bearer of an Imperial Wayleave\|Imperial Wayleave]]. Once complete it would create not one but ''two'' [[Imperial title\|Imperial titles]]. One would be appointed by business owners of the League - perhaps called something like ''Representative of the Mestran Hills Association'' - while the other would be appointed by the [[herb garden]] owners of Navarr - perhaps ''Representative of the Miaren Herbalist Fellowships''. Both would be annual Bourse titles, and each would control a [[ministry]]. If any decisions needed to be made about the Madieras Mutual Association, they would need to make them together - unanimous decisions of both the League and Navarr title holders.

Apoth: /* A Fifth City */

2024-04-13T16:32:16Z

A Fifth City

← Older revision		Revision as of 16:32, 13 April 2024
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	The problem, as Tassatan pundits on both sides of the river agree, is that it is not enough for a city to join the League. There are a number of limitations placed on large settlements by the requirement for food and water (among other things). For Seren, or Meade, or Siroc, or Kalpaheim to join the League, the entire territory of Miaren, or Mitwold, or Madruga, or Hahnmark would need to secede. This is simply inconceivable. Even more inconceivable is the idea that any of these cities - each a keystone of the culture to which they belong - may see that they had more in common with the League than with their own nations.		The problem, as Tassatan pundits on both sides of the river agree, is that it is not enough for a city to join the League. There are a number of limitations placed on large settlements by the requirement for food and water (among other things). For Seren, or Meade, or Siroc, or Kalpaheim to join the League, the entire territory of Miaren, or Mitwold, or Madruga, or Hahnmark would need to secede. This is simply inconceivable. Even more inconceivable is the idea that any of these cities - each a keystone of the culture to which they belong - may see that they had more in common with the League than with their own nations.

	The example of Temeschwar is raised several times, but most historians agree that the northernmost of the League cities had already grown far from its Varushkan roots long before the formation of the League. One need merely look to the example of [[Empress Giselle]] and her ill-fated efforts to convince the ~~aldermen~~ and dhomiro of Meade and Siroc to join the League, and how disastrously that turned out for her, to see the folly of trying to "steal" cities just because they ''are'' cities. A Navarr city would never prosper in the League - because at its heart it would still be Navarr.		The example of Temeschwar is raised several times, but most historians agree that the northernmost of the League cities had already grown far from its Varushkan roots long before the formation of the League. One need merely look to the example of [[Empress Giselle]] and her ill-fated efforts to convince the alders and dhomiro of Meade and Siroc to join the League, and how disastrously that turned out for her, to see the folly of trying to "steal" cities just because they ''are'' cities. A Navarr city would never prosper in the League - because at its heart it would still be Navarr.

	That is not to say that if the people of Siroc did eventually decide they had more in common with their League cousins to the north and the south that the League would turn them away. Far from it! But that desire to join the League would need to come from within, and would need to be so widespread that the entire territory chose to leave their former nation and become citizens of the League - something that could never be forced even with the new Senate power of relinquishment. As the early Sarvosan philosopher ''Iset Benedictus Saravos'' said after her visit to the White City "''It is not stone that makes a city, but people.''"		That is not to say that if the people of Siroc did eventually decide they had more in common with their League cousins to the north and the south that the League would turn them away. Far from it! But that desire to join the League would need to come from within, and would need to be so widespread that the entire territory chose to leave their former nation and become citizens of the League - something that could never be forced even with the new Senate power of relinquishment. As the early Sarvosan philosopher ''Iset Benedictus Saravos'' said after her visit to the White City "''It is not stone that makes a city, but people.''"

Rafferty: /* Solving the Ambassadorial Problem */

2023-07-03T14:28:52Z

Solving the Ambassadorial Problem

← Older revision		Revision as of 14:28, 3 July 2023
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	If the Senate chose to pursue this path, they could combine the amendment to the Consul's powers with the same motion required to commission the Consulate.		If the Senate chose to pursue this path, they could combine the amendment to the Consul's powers with the same motion required to commission the Consulate.

			'''As of Summer 385YE, this opportunity to amend the powers of the Imperial Consul to appoint ambassadors is no longer available.'''

	===Limited Opportunity===		===Limited Opportunity===

Hailmur: /* Little Mournwold */

2022-03-15T21:10:59Z

Little Mournwold

← Older revision		Revision as of 21:10, 15 March 2022
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	Others, however, stay. They settle down with Tassatan partners. They find that they enjoy working in a Guild more than they enjoyed working on a farm, or in a mine. They come to realise that actually there is only a fine gradation of difference between their lives back home, and their lives in the big city. By inches, they slowly become Tassatans. In turn, they bring Marcher food, Marcher festivals, and Marcher ideals to the people of Tassato. This is actually nothing new - over the centuries there have been periods where immigration from the Marches into Tassato has waxed and waned, and for the most part the city has been made the stronger for it.		Others, however, stay. They settle down with Tassatan partners. They find that they enjoy working in a Guild more than they enjoyed working on a farm, or in a mine. They come to realise that actually there is only a fine gradation of difference between their lives back home, and their lives in the big city. By inches, they slowly become Tassatans. In turn, they bring Marcher food, Marcher festivals, and Marcher ideals to the people of Tassato. This is actually nothing new - over the centuries there have been periods where immigration from the Marches into Tassato has waxed and waned, and for the most part the city has been made the stronger for it.

	Right now, however, the people of Little Mournwold are having troubles of their own. After years of trying to find a peaceful resolution to the problem posed by the people of Whittle, the Marcher assembly has had enough. They have ~~issues~~ a [[statement of principle]] giving the Whittle folk [[383YE_Summer_Solstice_Synod_judgements#Judgement_106\|an ultimatum]]. Reject their hateful practices or face the consequences. For many of the former Whittle folk living in Tassato, this is less about spiritual practices and more about the Whittle folk's refusal to accept that orcs can be their neighbours. Some of the other Marcher immigrants are conflicted - the Whittle folk are proud and stubborn but they shed blood to free the Mournwold from the Jotun. Surely there must be another way?		Right now, however, the people of Little Mournwold are having troubles of their own. After years of trying to find a peaceful resolution to the problem posed by the people of Whittle, the Marcher assembly has had enough. They have issued a [[statement of principle]] giving the Whittle folk [[383YE_Summer_Solstice_Synod_judgements#Judgement_106\|an ultimatum]]. Reject their hateful practices or face the consequences. For many of the former Whittle folk living in Tassato, this is less about spiritual practices and more about the Whittle folk's refusal to accept that orcs can be their neighbours. Some of the other Marcher immigrants are conflicted - the Whittle folk are proud and stubborn but they shed blood to free the Mournwold from the Jotun. Surely there must be another way?

	Merchant-Prince ''Mariana von Mestra'', of the Wildriver Crossing Guild, works closely with many of the Marcher folk living in Little Mournwold. She has been impressed with their work ethic, and their no-nonsense attitude, and listening to them grumble about the plight of the Whittle folk she has come up with a possible solution - one that she openly admits will prove very controversial.		Merchant-Prince ''Mariana von Mestra'', of the Wildriver Crossing Guild, works closely with many of the Marcher folk living in Little Mournwold. She has been impressed with their work ethic, and their no-nonsense attitude, and listening to them grumble about the plight of the Whittle folk she has come up with a possible solution - one that she openly admits will prove very controversial.

Hailmur: /* Establishing the Consulate */

2021-05-26T22:48:35Z

Establishing the Consulate

← Older revision		Revision as of 22:48, 26 May 2021
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	The Senate could declare the building derelict, and refurbish it as the Imperial Consulate. It stands on the eastern banks of the Vassa, and was built to incorporate a small private dock that would make it ideal for meeting with dignitaries from foreign nations if it was expanded slightly. The building foundations are good and the lower levels are sturdy enough. It could provide an ideal residence for the Consul, as well as rooms for a dozen staff - a staff hand-picked by the civil service from some of the finest diplomatic minds in Tassato.		The Senate could declare the building derelict, and refurbish it as the Imperial Consulate. It stands on the eastern banks of the Vassa, and was built to incorporate a small private dock that would make it ideal for meeting with dignitaries from foreign nations if it was expanded slightly. The building foundations are good and the lower levels are sturdy enough. It could provide an ideal residence for the Consul, as well as rooms for a dozen staff - a staff hand-picked by the civil service from some of the finest diplomatic minds in Tassato.

	Establishing the Imperial Consul would require 25 wains of weirwood and 15 wains of white granite to repair the building and expand the docks, as well as 80 Crowns in labour costs. Work would take three months, and it would require a Senate Motion to commission - and it would count against the Senate's limited number of commissions for the season when it was built. It would have an upkeep of 5 Thrones each season, just like any other embassy.The benefits to the Imperial Consul - who would be given custody of the building as it was commissioned of course - would be fourfold.		Establishing the Imperial Consul would require 25 wains of weirwood and 15 wains of white granite to repair the building and expand the docks, as well as 80 Crowns in labour costs. Work would take three months, and it would require a Senate Motion to commission - and it would count against the Senate's limited number of commissions for the season when it was built. It would have an upkeep of 5 Thrones each season, just like any other embassy. The benefits to the Imperial Consul - who would be given custody of the building as it was commissioned of course - would be fourfold.

	* First, they would have finely appointed apartments in the finest city in the Empire that would be for their exclusive use. It is easy to under-estimate the benefits of such arrangements, but they are important, especially when dealing with foreign powers. It is difficult for the Consul to impress visitors with the power and commitment of the Empire without the accoutrements of state to dignify that.		* First, they would have finely appointed apartments in the finest city in the Empire that would be for their exclusive use. It is easy to under-estimate the benefits of such arrangements, but they are important, especially when dealing with foreign powers. It is difficult for the Consul to impress visitors with the power and commitment of the Empire without the accoutrements of state to dignify that.

Responsible1: /* Establishing the Consulate */

2019-09-10T19:03:31Z

Establishing the Consulate

← Older revision		Revision as of 19:03, 10 September 2019
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	* '''An Imperial Consulate could be built in Tassato Regario, providing several benefits for the Imperial Consul.'''		* '''An Imperial Consulate could be built in Tassato Regario, providing several benefits for the Imperial Consul.'''
	* '''The commission would cost a senate motion, 25 wains of weirwood, 15 wains of white granite, and 80 Crowns in labour costs.'''		* '''The commission would cost a senate motion, 25 wains of weirwood, 15 wains of white granite, and 80 Crowns in labour costs.'''
	It so happens that the Featherwick Guild has the perfect site in mind. A stone's throw from the University of Tassato, in [[Tassato#Tassato Regario\|Regario]], is a four storey building that belonged to ~~Price~~ Benjamin's great aunt. Following her death - she very intentionally died without disposing of the premises - a decades long fight between her relatives over who would take custody of the prime real estate erupted. Now, everyone who might have had a claim on the building is either dead or has moved to the country to get away from their relatives. The building is falling apart - nobody has made any effort to maintain it in thirty years. Indeed, the place is becoming reasonably dangerous to passers by and is likely to fall down within the next few years.		It so happens that the Featherwick Guild has the perfect site in mind. A stone's throw from the University of Tassato, in [[Tassato#Tassato Regario\|Regario]], is a four storey building that belonged to Prince Benjamin's great aunt. Following her death - she very intentionally died without disposing of the premises - a decades long fight between her relatives over who would take custody of the prime real estate erupted. Now, everyone who might have had a claim on the building is either dead or has moved to the country to get away from their relatives. The building is falling apart - nobody has made any effort to maintain it in thirty years. Indeed, the place is becoming reasonably dangerous to passers by and is likely to fall down within the next few years.

	The Senate could declare the building derelict, and refurbish it as the Imperial Consulate. It stands on the eastern banks of the Vassa, and was built to incorporate a small private dock that would make it ideal for meeting with dignitaries from foreign nations if it was expanded slightly. The building foundations are good and the lower levels are sturdy enough. It could provide an ideal residence for the Consul, as well as rooms for a dozen staff - a staff hand-picked by the civil service from some of the finest diplomatic minds in Tassato.		The Senate could declare the building derelict, and refurbish it as the Imperial Consulate. It stands on the eastern banks of the Vassa, and was built to incorporate a small private dock that would make it ideal for meeting with dignitaries from foreign nations if it was expanded slightly. The building foundations are good and the lower levels are sturdy enough. It could provide an ideal residence for the Consul, as well as rooms for a dozen staff - a staff hand-picked by the civil service from some of the finest diplomatic minds in Tassato.
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	* First, they would have finely appointed apartments in the finest city in the Empire that would be for their exclusive use. It is easy to under-estimate the benefits of such arrangements, but they are important, especially when dealing with foreign powers. It is difficult for the Consul to impress visitors with the power and commitment of the Empire without the accoutrements of state to dignify that.		* First, they would have finely appointed apartments in the finest city in the Empire that would be for their exclusive use. It is easy to under-estimate the benefits of such arrangements, but they are important, especially when dealing with foreign powers. It is difficult for the Consul to impress visitors with the power and commitment of the Empire without the accoutrements of state to dignify that.

	* Second, with the establishment of the Consulate, and the provision of offices for a support staff chosen from the diplomatic corps and the most articulate graduates of Tassato University, the Imperial Consul would be able to receive a regular briefing on the Empire's diplomatic status. The briefing would in theory contain any information about the various barbarian and foreign nations the Empire did not have an existing ambassador to deal with, but it would also contain rough overviews of the relationship between the Empire and the nations they ''did'' have an Embassy with. While not as in depth as the briefings received by the individual Ambassadors, it would certainly help the Consul discharge their duties as a ~~liason~~ between the ambassadors and the Senate.		* Second, with the establishment of the Consulate, and the provision of offices for a support staff chosen from the diplomatic corps and the most articulate graduates of Tassato University, the Imperial Consul would be able to receive a regular briefing on the Empire's diplomatic status. The briefing would in theory contain any information about the various barbarian and foreign nations the Empire did not have an existing ambassador to deal with, but it would also contain rough overviews of the relationship between the Empire and the nations they ''did'' have an Embassy with. While not as in depth as the briefings received by the individual Ambassadors, it would certainly help the Consul discharge their duties as a liaison between the ambassadors and the Senate.

	* Third, while the Consul has no legal authority to deal with [[Axos]], the [[Commonwealth]] and the others, most foreign nations understand that there is more to politics than dealing with an ambassador. As such, the Consul would gain a unique version of the [[Ambassador#Mercantile_Support\|mercantile support]] benefit the ambassadors enjoy. Merchants and those seeking favour from every foreign nation with which the Empire has established an Embassy would send representatives to Tassato to visit the Consulate. This would create a series of ministries that would allow the ambassador to acquire trade goods from those merchants at a reasonable price. They would not be on the same scale as the ministries enjoyed by the specific ambassadors, but the Consul would have many more of them to choose from.		* Third, while the Consul has no legal authority to deal with [[Axos]], the [[Commonwealth]] and the others, most foreign nations understand that there is more to politics than dealing with an ambassador. As such, the Consul would gain a unique version of the [[Ambassador#Mercantile_Support\|mercantile support]] benefit the ambassadors enjoy. Merchants and those seeking favour from every foreign nation with which the Empire has established an Embassy would send representatives to Tassato to visit the Consulate. This would create a series of ministries that would allow the ambassador to acquire trade goods from those merchants at a reasonable price. They would not be on the same scale as the ministries enjoyed by the specific ambassadors, but the Consul would have many more of them to choose from.

Rafferty: /* Little Mournwold */

2019-09-09T19:02:22Z

Little Mournwold

← Older revision		Revision as of 19:02, 9 September 2019
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	Obviously, the mandate would also entail accepting known heretics into the League. But Merchant-Prince Mariana is adamant that these people are misguided and not evil - her argument is that away from the orcs they hate there would be plenty of opportunity to slowly wean them away from their spiritual crutch and help them embrace the ways of the League. As long as the League does not attempt to assimilate orcs before the Whittle folk have been convinced to put aside their hatred - optimistically this will take at least thirty years or so - then there should be little chance of a recurrence of the problems they are currently causing in the Marches.		Obviously, the mandate would also entail accepting known heretics into the League. But Merchant-Prince Mariana is adamant that these people are misguided and not evil - her argument is that away from the orcs they hate there would be plenty of opportunity to slowly wean them away from their spiritual crutch and help them embrace the ways of the League. As long as the League does not attempt to assimilate orcs before the Whittle folk have been convinced to put aside their hatred - optimistically this will take at least thirty years or so - then there should be little chance of a recurrence of the problems they are currently causing in the Marches.

	Further details about the situation of the Whittle folk can be found [[here]].		Further details about the situation of the Whittle folk can be found [[In_the_flat_field\|here]].

	==The poor choice==		==The poor choice==

Cathtice: /* A Fifth City */

2019-09-09T13:37:17Z

A Fifth City

← Older revision		Revision as of 13:37, 9 September 2019
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	During the Summer Solstice, Alfredo Barossa presented a [[statement of principle]] before the League national assembly that encouraged the city of Seren to secede from the Navarr nation and become the fifth city of the League. Having achieved a [[greater majority]], the statement was duly circulated among the priests of the four cities. Inevitably, word of Alfredo's words reached the people of Seren themselves. The statement has received a mixed reception, to put it mildly.		During the Summer Solstice, Alfredo Barossa presented a [[statement of principle]] before the League national assembly that encouraged the city of Seren to secede from the Navarr nation and become the fifth city of the League. Having achieved a [[greater majority]], the statement was duly circulated among the priests of the four cities. Inevitably, word of Alfredo's words reached the people of Seren themselves. The statement has received a mixed reception, to put it mildly.

	It is not clear what the author of the judgement intended, but some both in the League and among the Navarr are concerned that it is nothing more than mockery of Seren's ambitions. As the bitter pundit "Ruffio Telemsca di Mestra" wrote in his regular newspaper column "''We expect better of our bishops - even ill-bred Regarian bishops - than to demean the Ambition and Pride of our fellow Imperial citizens.''" Others, however, have chosen to take the statement at face value, and a series of heated discussions have broken out in various salons and coffee shops across the cities. Nowhere has this debate been more heated than Tassato. The western city shares a border with Miaren, and Navarr traders and merchants are a common sight on both sides of the river. A lecture at the School of Epistemology about historical efforts to encourage other cities to join the League - some of them reaching back as far as the original formation of the nation when both Siroc and Meade were allegedly invited to join Aldones' ambitious endeavour - these discussions have widened to include the entire topic of other cities joining the League.		It is not clear what the author of the judgement intended, but some both in the League and among the Navarr are concerned that it is nothing more than mockery of Seren's ambitions. As the bitter pundit ''Ruffio Telemsca di Mestra'' wrote in his regular newspaper column "''We expect better of our bishops - even ill-bred Regarian bishops - than to demean the Ambition and Pride of our fellow Imperial citizens.''" Others, however, have chosen to take the statement at face value, and a series of heated discussions have broken out in various salons and coffee shops across the cities. Nowhere has this debate been more heated than Tassato. The western city shares a border with Miaren, and Navarr traders and merchants are a common sight on both sides of the river. A lecture at the School of Epistemology about historical efforts to encourage other cities to join the League - some of them reaching back as far as the original formation of the nation when both Siroc and Meade were allegedly invited to join Aldones' ambitious endeavour - these discussions have widened to include the entire topic of other cities joining the League.
	<div style="float:right; width: 450px; clear: right;"><quote by="Anonymous citizen of Seren">Seren was a great city when Temeschwar was no more than a collection of hovels, before Sarvos knew what a mirror was, when Tassato was just two fishing villages throwing fish heads at each other, and Holberg a nervous little hill fort huddling against the side of the mountain and hoping the orcs wouldn't spot it.</quote></div>		<div style="float:right; width: 450px; clear: right;"><quote by="Anonymous citizen of Seren">Seren was a great city when Temeschwar was no more than a collection of hovels, before Sarvos knew what a mirror was, when Tassato was just two fishing villages throwing fish heads at each other, and Holberg a nervous little hill fort huddling against the side of the mountain and hoping the orcs wouldn't spot it.</quote></div>
	The problem, as Tassatan pundits on both sides of the river agree, is that it is not enough for a city to join the League. There are a number of ~~limitation~~ placed on large settlements by the requirement for food and water (among other things). For Seren, or Meade, or Siroc, or Kalpaheim to join the League, the entire territory of Miaren, or Mitwold, or Madruga, or Hahnmark would need to secede. This is simply inconceivable. Even more inconceivable is the idea that any of these cities - each a keystone of the culture to which they belong - may see that they had more in common with the League than with their own nations.		The problem, as Tassatan pundits on both sides of the river agree, is that it is not enough for a city to join the League. There are a number of limitations placed on large settlements by the requirement for food and water (among other things). For Seren, or Meade, or Siroc, or Kalpaheim to join the League, the entire territory of Miaren, or Mitwold, or Madruga, or Hahnmark would need to secede. This is simply inconceivable. Even more inconceivable is the idea that any of these cities - each a keystone of the culture to which they belong - may see that they had more in common with the League than with their own nations.

	The example of Temeschwar is raised several times, but most historians agree that the northernmost of the League cities had already grown far from its Varushkan roots long before the formation of the League. One need merely look to the example of [[Empress Giselle]] and her ill-fated efforts to convince the aldermen and dhomiro of Meade and Siroc to join the League, and how disastrously that turned out for her, to see the folly of trying to "steal" cities just because they ''are'' cities. A Navarr city would never prosper in the League - because at its heart it would still be Navarr.		The example of Temeschwar is raised several times, but most historians agree that the northernmost of the League cities had already grown far from its Varushkan roots long before the formation of the League. One need merely look to the example of [[Empress Giselle]] and her ill-fated efforts to convince the aldermen and dhomiro of Meade and Siroc to join the League, and how disastrously that turned out for her, to see the folly of trying to "steal" cities just because they ''are'' cities. A Navarr city would never prosper in the League - because at its heart it would still be Navarr.

	That is not to say that if the people of Siroc did eventually decide they had more in common with their League cousins to the north and the south that the League would turn them away. Far from it! But that desire to join the League would need to come from within, and would need to be so widespread that the entire territory chose to leave their former nation and become citizens of the League - something that could never be forced even with the new Senate power of relinquishment. As the early Sarvosan philosopher Iset Benedictus Saravos said after her visit to the White City "''It is not stone that makes a city, but people.''"		That is not to say that if the people of Siroc did eventually decide they had more in common with their League cousins to the north and the south that the League would turn them away. Far from it! But that desire to join the League would need to come from within, and would need to be so widespread that the entire territory chose to leave their former nation and become citizens of the League - something that could never be forced even with the new Senate power of relinquishment. As the early Sarvosan philosopher ''Iset Benedictus Saravos'' said after her visit to the White City "''It is not stone that makes a city, but people.''"

	As the discussions begin to die down, however, there are some positive suggestions made in the light of the Barossa statement. Both come from the people of Tassato - possibly because the people of Temeschwar, Sarvos, and Holberg have their own concerns at the moment, more pressing than questions of Navarr cities.		As the discussions begin to die down, however, there are some positive suggestions made in the light of the Barossa statement. Both come from the people of Tassato - possibly because the people of Temeschwar, Sarvos, and Holberg have their own concerns at the moment, more pressing than questions of Navarr cities.
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	Her plan involves building a trading post - an inn, warehouses, and residences - at the base of the hills in western Madeiras. The mining guilds - lead by the ''Forge and Furnace Fellowship'' of course - would divert ore directly from the mines to the trading post for sale to Navarr merchants prepared to travel the extra miles from Tagliano. Half the buildings would be given over to the Navarr, who would use them to sell herbs to the Tassatan mining guilds at a reasonable price.		Her plan involves building a trading post - an inn, warehouses, and residences - at the base of the hills in western Madeiras. The mining guilds - lead by the ''Forge and Furnace Fellowship'' of course - would divert ore directly from the mines to the trading post for sale to Navarr merchants prepared to travel the extra miles from Tagliano. Half the buildings would be given over to the Navarr, who would use them to sell herbs to the Tassatan mining guilds at a reasonable price.

	Gemma's ~~Proposal~~ would require 15 wains of mithril (to lay tracks to transport the ore) and 10 wains of weirwood. Labour would cost 50 crowns, and it would take three months to complete construction, It could be [[commission\|commissioned]] with a [[Senate motion]] or an [[Bearer of an Imperial Wayleave\|Imperial Wayleave]]. Once complete it would create not one but ''two'' [[Imperial title\|Imperial titles]]. One would be appointed by business owners of the League - perhaps called something like ''Representative of the Mestran Hills Association'' - while the other would be appointed by the [[herb garden]] owners of Navarr - perhaps ''Representative of the Miaren Herbalist Fellowships''. Both would be annual Bourse titles, and each would control a [[ministry]]. If any decisions needed to be made about the Madieras Mutual Association, they would need to make them together - unanimous decisions of both the League and Navarr title holders.		Gemma's proposal would require 15 wains of mithril (to lay tracks to transport the ore) and 10 wains of weirwood. Labour would cost 50 crowns, and it would take three months to complete construction, It could be [[commission\|commissioned]] with a [[Senate motion]] or an [[Bearer of an Imperial Wayleave\|Imperial Wayleave]]. Once complete it would create not one but ''two'' [[Imperial title\|Imperial titles]]. One would be appointed by business owners of the League - perhaps called something like ''Representative of the Mestran Hills Association'' - while the other would be appointed by the [[herb garden]] owners of Navarr - perhaps ''Representative of the Miaren Herbalist Fellowships''. Both would be annual Bourse titles, and each would control a [[ministry]]. If any decisions needed to be made about the Madieras Mutual Association, they would need to make them together - unanimous decisions of both the League and Navarr title holders.

	===Limited Opportunity===		===Limited Opportunity===